I’d say that I’m rather anti communistic but one thing that has never happened in used-to-be communist country i have experience with is starvation.
Actually they solved starvation, built fcking appartments for everyone to live in and gave them to people for free. They also made sure every forgotten village had drinakble water, electricity , gas, shop, train station and bus stop.
Reason why people overthrown them was humans rights repression like taking away people’s businesses to make them state companies. It was not poor the living conditions (for the time).
And also just homelessness. It’s pretty amusing that people believe there are no homeless people in Russia or China. China in particular is amusing because they have massive empty apartment blocks, but they still have homeless people because the hukou caste system means they aren’t allowed to live outside their birth city.
Its pretty amusing that people still believe Russia and China are communist. Next your going to tell me the Nazi’s were socialist and North Korea is a Democratic Republic, just because it’s in their name.
Typing it all in caps doesn’t make it not true. Words have meanings, Russia and China both have private corporations run for profit. They do have some socialist policies, but they certainly do not have economic systems characterized by the collective ownership of property and by the organization of labor for the common advantage of all members.
If you keep having people tell you “those aren’t real communists”, then just maybe you should reevaluate your definition of Communism.
When did I try to form a Utopia, or call Russia and China a utopia, or call Communist countries utopias? Also, that wasn’t my definition of Communism, it was the American Heritage Dictionary’s (5th edition).
I think what you meant to say was “If countries that have tried to implement Communism consistently add Market Economics, then perhaps Communism is not a self-sufficient system, and as such it is not a comprehensive solution to the ills of Capitalism”. Which wouldn’t change the definition of Communism, but would at least be an argument that makes sense.
Also, as much as I hate to say it, Trump did win the 2016 election. Not the Popular vote mind you, but the election all the same. Unless you mean the 2020 election, in which case I’ll have to go ahead and state what should have been an obvious caveat. When evaluating anything, it’s important to make sure you check your facts and sources.
Saying “maybe you should reevaluate” =/= “must be true”. People did reevaluate if Trump won the 2020 election (a bit too many times frankly), and every time it came up to be a false claim. Just because people keep telling you that you are wrong about the definition of Communism, doesn’t mean every thing others say “must be true”… Frankly that assertion is just stupid.
P.S.
Just curious, do you ever get tired of misrepresenting the positions you are arguing against? Seems like conversations have no where to go when you engage as such.
If any bad thing that happens under a nominally communist system is the fault of communism, then any bad thing that happens in a nominally capitalist system must be the fault of capitalism, right? Capitalism has an awful lot of slavery, genocide, apartheid, coloialism, wars of choice, and other evils to answer for, then.
The internet wasn’t designed by Capitalism. It was a government funded program. It would be a lot easier for me to take you seriously of you didn’t make shit up to prop up an ideology.
So the undersea cables, radio towers, satellites that are the very lifeblood of the Internet were the result of communism? Cause last I checked telecommunication networks and infrastructure are one of the most glaring examples of capitalism doing what it does best. The resources and will were all motivated by capitalism. If not for capitalism the Internet would have stayed a niche government program and not gained worldwide adoption.
First off, just because something is developed in the public sector does not make it Communist. If you don’t know what words mean, don’t use them please. I don’t have time to go over definitions.
Secondly, the ground work for undersea cables, radio towers and satellites were indeed a direct result of work and funding from the public sector. The private sector wanted nothing to do with the internet until the mid 90’s when enough work had been done that it was deemed “profitable”.
A better example of what Capitalism does best would be adding advertisements to the internet, or the fact that Americans pay more per megabit than any European country on average.
This is not a valid argument ecause everything surrounding us is designed and facilitated by capitalism, and certainly all our electronics, there’s no such thing as computers independent from capitalism. There weren’t even in the soviet union. So it’s not possible for this anon to actually live what they preach unless they went full anarcho-primitivism.
Not that it would matter anyway, because you’re allowed to criticize a system that you participate in.
Nothing here is portraying capitalism as pure evil, it’s highlighting a problem that we currently have as a society. I find it really weird how eager you are to argue while not really having a point to make.
It is a historical fact that communist countries typically go through one last famine on their way to ending periodic famines in the country forever, and sometimes they’re worse than normal due to the kinks being ironed out and social unrest.
How is that not a valid critique? I despise Apple as a company. As a result I refuse to purchase any of their products or use any of their services. To this day I have never purchased a single Apple product. I do this because I have conviction and standards.
1st world communists like to denigrate capitalism, yet live comfortable lives because of it. That shows zero conviction or standards.
Communism’s solution to homelessness is mass starvation.
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/document/cia-rdp84b00274r000300150009-5
do you believe Iraq had WMDs too?
I’d say that I’m rather anti communistic but one thing that has never happened in used-to-be communist country i have experience with is starvation.
Actually they solved starvation, built fcking appartments for everyone to live in and gave them to people for free. They also made sure every forgotten village had drinakble water, electricity , gas, shop, train station and bus stop.
Reason why people overthrown them was humans rights repression like taking away people’s businesses to make them state companies. It was not poor the living conditions (for the time).
And also just homelessness. It’s pretty amusing that people believe there are no homeless people in Russia or China. China in particular is amusing because they have massive empty apartment blocks, but they still have homeless people because the hukou caste system means they aren’t allowed to live outside their birth city.
Its pretty amusing that people still believe Russia and China are communist. Next your going to tell me the Nazi’s were socialist and North Korea is a Democratic Republic, just because it’s in their name.
Ah, the classic “THOSE ARENT REAL COMMUNISTS” arguments. And Jeff Bezos isn’t a real capitalist.
Typing it all in caps doesn’t make it not true. Words have meanings, Russia and China both have private corporations run for profit. They do have some socialist policies, but they certainly do not have economic systems characterized by the collective ownership of property and by the organization of labor for the common advantage of all members.
If you keep having people tell you “those aren’t real communists”, then just maybe you should reevaluate your definition of Communism.
And if you need to incorporate market economics everytime you try to form a utopia, maybe you should reevaluate your definition of Communism.
Next you’re gonna tell me Trump actually won the election. By your logic it must be true, people keep repeating it after all.
When did I try to form a Utopia, or call Russia and China a utopia, or call Communist countries utopias? Also, that wasn’t my definition of Communism, it was the American Heritage Dictionary’s (5th edition).
I think what you meant to say was “If countries that have tried to implement Communism consistently add Market Economics, then perhaps Communism is not a self-sufficient system, and as such it is not a comprehensive solution to the ills of Capitalism”. Which wouldn’t change the definition of Communism, but would at least be an argument that makes sense.
Also, as much as I hate to say it, Trump did win the 2016 election. Not the Popular vote mind you, but the election all the same. Unless you mean the 2020 election, in which case I’ll have to go ahead and state what should have been an obvious caveat. When evaluating anything, it’s important to make sure you check your facts and sources.
Saying “maybe you should reevaluate” =/= “must be true”. People did reevaluate if Trump won the 2020 election (a bit too many times frankly), and every time it came up to be a false claim. Just because people keep telling you that you are wrong about the definition of Communism, doesn’t mean every thing others say “must be true”… Frankly that assertion is just stupid.
P.S. Just curious, do you ever get tired of misrepresenting the positions you are arguing against? Seems like conversations have no where to go when you engage as such.
If its a response that is “classic” why don’t you have a rebuttal?
Capitalism’s solution to homelessness is mass starvation… in underdeveloped countries. With a side of bombs. All in the name of democracy
The USSR and China were pretty developed at the time of their mass starvations.
That’s the fascist solution to this problem. Don’t worry, capitalism is considering it.
People keep denying it, trying to bury it, but it’s historical fact.
If any bad thing that happens under a nominally communist system is the fault of communism, then any bad thing that happens in a nominally capitalist system must be the fault of capitalism, right? Capitalism has an awful lot of slavery, genocide, apartheid, coloialism, wars of choice, and other evils to answer for, then.
Yes. Concentration of power is bad no matter the economic system.
Yes, all of the evils of capitalism are constantly commented on. This isn’t the CNN comments section.
All typed on a device and shared over a network designed and facilitated by capitalism.
It would be a whole lot easier for me to take you seriously if you actually lived what you preach.
You are very intelligent.
Thank you. I was educated in government run schools. Yay communism!
The internet wasn’t designed by Capitalism. It was a government funded program. It would be a lot easier for me to take you seriously of you didn’t make shit up to prop up an ideology.
And it was improved at an incredible pace by private industry.
So the undersea cables, radio towers, satellites that are the very lifeblood of the Internet were the result of communism? Cause last I checked telecommunication networks and infrastructure are one of the most glaring examples of capitalism doing what it does best. The resources and will were all motivated by capitalism. If not for capitalism the Internet would have stayed a niche government program and not gained worldwide adoption.
First off, just because something is developed in the public sector does not make it Communist. If you don’t know what words mean, don’t use them please. I don’t have time to go over definitions.
Secondly, the ground work for undersea cables, radio towers and satellites were indeed a direct result of work and funding from the public sector. The private sector wanted nothing to do with the internet until the mid 90’s when enough work had been done that it was deemed “profitable”.
A better example of what Capitalism does best would be adding advertisements to the internet, or the fact that Americans pay more per megabit than any European country on average.
What? The early Internet underseas cables were laid down for phones, mostly by private companies.
Fair point, the majority was laid by private companies, but the research for modern fiber optic cables was done at publicly funded universities.
This is not a valid argument ecause everything surrounding us is designed and facilitated by capitalism, and certainly all our electronics, there’s no such thing as computers independent from capitalism. There weren’t even in the soviet union. So it’s not possible for this anon to actually live what they preach unless they went full anarcho-primitivism.
Not that it would matter anyway, because you’re allowed to criticize a system that you participate in.
So you’re saying capitalism isn’t the pure evil it’s portrayed as here?
Nothing here is portraying capitalism as pure evil, it’s highlighting a problem that we currently have as a society. I find it really weird how eager you are to argue while not really having a point to make.
What a convenient way for you to deflect any opinion you disagree with, “you criticize society yet you participate in it”
It is a historical fact that communist countries typically go through one last famine on their way to ending periodic famines in the country forever, and sometimes they’re worse than normal due to the kinks being ironed out and social unrest.
How is that not a valid critique? I despise Apple as a company. As a result I refuse to purchase any of their products or use any of their services. To this day I have never purchased a single Apple product. I do this because I have conviction and standards.
1st world communists like to denigrate capitalism, yet live comfortable lives because of it. That shows zero conviction or standards.